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Muscle Car engines ? - Graham - 8th-Feb-26

A question for our friends across the pond ?
I believe that muscle cars of the 60's and 70's used 3litre or higher capacity engines, but is it a characteristic of ALL muscle cars ?
Were there any under 3litre capacity motor muscle cars ?

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - Kevan - 8th-Feb-26

It's one of those no-definitive-answer questions. 

When we had a muscle car night, people were turning up with 65-68 Mustangs, Corvette C5 roadsters... neither of which are what I'd call muscle cars.

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - KensRedZed - 8th-Feb-26

It depends on how broad your idea is of the phrase "muscle car".

On this side of the pond. A muscle car in the 60's and 70's typically had a V8 that was modified to make more power.

1969 ZL1 Corvettes made 600-horsepower. Late 70's and 80's Corvettes with stock V8's were polution controlled dogs.

6-cyl Camaro = Not a muscle car.
V8 Z-28 option = true muscle car.

6-cyl Mustang = Not a muscle car.
428 Cobra-Jet Mustang = true muscle car
429 Boss Mustang = they don't have more muscle than this.

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - KensRedZed - 8th-Feb-26

This is a '67 Mustang GT. It came with a 325hp - 390 cubic inch V8 (Same as the Bullit Mustang). I remember watching these cars as a kid. They would smoke the rear tires from a stop sign.

[attachment=46067]
[attachment=46068]

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - Kevan - 8th-Feb-26

Aren't Mustangs classified as pony cars rather than muscle cars?

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - ARUP - 8th-Feb-26

I was always partial to 'foreign' cars as a youngster and even had a '59 MGA roadster from 1976 to 1980 but the other fellas who had the 'muscle' cars all had 'V-8' engines, 4 speed tranny, traction bars, 'jacked-up' rear ends and etc. Their cars could 'light the tires' from a stand still and were good for point and shoot driving. I routinely embarrassed them on the 'twisties' but they always caught me in the straights! I still live in Kentucky and still enjoy the ride of my '58 MGA! I recently acquired an exceptionally nice concours level 1958 Austin Healey 'Sprite'. I can't wait to drive it when the weather gets warmer. Take that.... muscle car motorheads! Lol

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - Graham - 8th-Feb-26

(8th-Feb-26, 09:11 PM)KensRedZed Wrote:  It depends on how broad your idea is of the phrase "muscle car".

On this side of the pond. A muscle car in the 60's and 70's typically had a V8 that was modified to make more power.

1969 ZL1 Corvettes made 600-horsepower. Late 70's and 80's Corvettes with stock V8's were polution controlled dogs.

6-cyl Camaro = Not a muscle car.
V8 Z-28 option = true muscle car.

6-cyl Mustang = Not a muscle car.
428 Cobra-Jet Mustang = true muscle car
429 Boss Mustang = they don't have more muscle than this.

So did a 1965 Mustang Knotchback and a 70's GT350 have a V8 motor, and therefore called muscle cars ?

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - KensRedZed - 9th-Feb-26

The key words mentioned were "modified to make more horsepower".

There were stock muscle cars like the Shelby Mustang GT-350. Or, you could take your average notchback Mustang and install all the GT-350 engine and chassis upgrades and turn it into a muscle car. Your average 1965 Mustang with a small V8 might not have been considered a muscle car.

Let's keep in mind that Ford offered a lot of engine options in the 60's. Not all V8's are created equal.

Straight-6
289-V8 (older)
302-V8 (newer)
302-V8 Boss (Trans Am engine)
351-V8
390-V8
428 Cobra Jet
429 Boss Hemi

Ford also made a 460 cubic inch engine that went into a few full size cars back then.

Your budget was the limit.

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - KensRedZed - 9th-Feb-26

From Google:

"The term "pony car" to describe members of its ranks was coined by Car Life magazine editor Dennis Shattuck. The characteristics of a pony car were generally defined as: A sporty compact car for the masses, that could carry four people. Long hood, short deck profile, and "open mouth" styling."

Pony cars with a lot of power were considered muscle cars.

I used to be an automotive machinist back in the early 80's rebuilding V8 cars from the 60's and 70's. Mostly for drag-racing.

Now you got me started.

Let's put the 351 under the microscope for a moment. There were 3 different types. The 351 Windsor, a 351 Cleveland, and a 351M. All three engines were completely different. The Windsor and Cleveland were as if from different planets. Nothing interchanged at all.

The 1969 351 Windsor was a small-block engine. Small in size. It was actually based on the 302, but modified to accept the longer stroke. Somewhat of a grocery getter.

The 1970 351 Cleveland was consider a big block with "Boss" status. Gap and Roush were famous drag racers that broke pro-stock records. The cylinder heads were incredible. You could easily stick your hand into the intake or exhaust ports. Baaad gas mileage would be an understatement. 6-miles to the gallon was normal.

The 351M was a polution controlled turd of hurdles... best used as a boat anchor.

RE: Muscle Car engines ? - Gpa113 - 9th-Feb-26

Hi Ken  Wavegreen

Brilliant explanation, as always!